The Old Testament is so boring and so is most of the sermons that I hear on it. “How to pray like Nehemiah” or “How to have the attitude of Joseph” or “Why not complain when you are in a desert situation” or “Why you have to get some friends out of your boat of promise” or “How adultery destroys your testimony” or “The leafs and onions of Egypt”….. I could continue but I digress.
Not to mention the yearly bible plans are cool if I could read something that I liked. Unlike Leviticus, Numbers, Chronicles, Nahum, Obadiah ……. which can become quite redundant and boring.
However, when the Old Testament is faithfully exposited through Christoloigcal lenses the Old Testament becomes just as exciting as the New Testament. So here is yet another plug for a case for biblical theology. About a year and a half ago I was introduced to biblical theology by wrestling through New Covenant Theology and Covenantal Theology.
Men like Goldsworthy, Azurdia, Poythress, Clowney, Dale Ralph Davis and Vos not to mention sites like Beginning with Moses and Biblical Theology . If you are new there a few great introduction books and a host of articles and writings on the two links above. Listening to Azurdia and Keller is also a really good way to get acquainted to this type of biblical interpretation.
As you being your new bible reading plans keep the verse below in mind I believe it will help you gain an unquenchable passion for the Old Testament scriptures and help you understand the Theocentrcity (God Centeredness) and Christocentric (Christ Centered) nature of the Old Testament. Not to mention we find the Gospel written throughout all of the Old Testament in shadows and pictures:
44 Then he said to them, “These are my words that I spoke to you while I was still with you, that everything written about me in the Law of Moses and the Prophets and the Psalms must be fulfilled.” 45 Then he opened their minds to understand the Scriptures, 46 and said to them, “Thus it is written, that the Christ should suffer and on the third day rise from the dead, 47 and that repentance and forgiveness of sins should be proclaimed in his name to all nations, beginning from Jerusalem. 48 You are witnesses of these things. 49 And behold, I am sending the promise of my Father upon you. But stay in the city until you are clothed with power from on high.”
Lionel,
Man, you are so right. I do the whole read through the whole bible routine every year. For myself only. And it was like pulling teeth reading the Old.
As you have stated though now that I am reading in regards of how it is talking about Christ my time is spent looking forward to reading.
Seeing Christ in Genesis, Exodus etc. is really great.
Steven Owen
Lionel
I am not sure I would agree with you that the OT is boring reading,considered by and of itself.I think within the stories of rapes,stolen inheritances,cultural chauvinism etc are powerful messages for us today.
I think it all depends on the eyes with which we come to the OT.What exactly are our expectations when we come to this fascinating revelation of God’s will.You see,while the NT is largely concerned with the Christological revelation in 4 gospels,it is also concerned with such ‘abstract’ theological concepts as election,grace,ordination etc.
The OT on the other hand primarily allows us to see God at work through the character,the everyday lives of ordinary men and women that God choses to use to give effect to His will.Lionel, I think that in broad terms the purposes of the 2 covenants are not the same,and that we should therefore not approach the OT and the NT with identical spectacles.What is the Christological message in the Song of Songs for example?
Every bit of God’s Word is of direct ,eternal relevance,by and of itself.They address every kind of situation we find ourselves.Contained within Psalms for example are songs of joy,hymns of praise,cries of lamentations,cries of help,curses on enemies etc.
Tunji,
You wrote:
“I am not sure I would agree with you that the OT is boring reading,considered by and of itself.I think within the stories of rapes,stolen inheritances,cultural chauvinism etc are powerful messages for us today.”
I say when read with self-help interpretive lenses those narratives are robbed of their redemptive purposes.
You also said:
“Every bit of God’s Word is of direct ,eternal relevance,by and of itself”
I will say I would have to disagree, because the Spirit who inspired them, did not write them to “have relevance by and of itself” but to point to Christ the true Israelite who succeeds where every other Israelite (even the best ones) failed, thus fullfilling the messianic promises weaved throughout all of the Old Testament.
A side note” there are many, many commentaries and books on the Song of Songs but I am sure you know that already.
Tunji, if I may say something. I also agree with some of your thoughts. Except try going through 2 Chronicles again and it can be a bit tedious. Maybe not boring, but tedious.
I love all of the word of God myself.
Try Leviticus,
As a matter of fact try to apply Leviticus in a “relevant” way today and see where you end up. LOL. Oh yeah not to mention quite a few of the “minor” prophets. Read Nahum to your kids tonight and see how excited they get.
I love the OT. But here is where I struggle:
In my sincere effort not to take the bible out of its context, I stay away from it in terms of application. I’m not sure what’s good for me to apply and what’s specifically for the people at that time (some stuff I can readily recognize but other stuff I can’t). So as a result, I tend to dodge it in study (I know…bad, bad Christian!) except for the Psalms and Proverbs. And when I do study it, I look at it more as a history than something I can apply.
I’m really confused in this area. I’ve got questions…who’s got answers??? (LOL)
J-Boogie,
Follow the links and see what you get. I promise you, this is how the Apostles read and understood their bibles. Don’t believe me. Start at Acts 2 and see what Peter quotes then work through the rest of your New Testament. Romans 3 the entire book of Hebrews, 1 Peter 2, Romans 9-11, Galatians 3, they all used a Christocentric hermeneutic. Oh, yeah what about Matthew He quotes Hosea talking about the “son coming out of Egypt” and also takes a prophecy that many would have immediately applied in Isaiah and applies it to the virgin birth.
Now if we want to get into the picture/fulfillment or shadow conversation we can go all day. We see Christ in all of the festivals, sacrficies and a great deal of the Law, we see Christ in the desert 40 years and not falling, unlike the nation of Israel, we see Christ fulfilling the Sabbath, we see Christ fulfilling the land of rest, we see Christ fulfilling the promised seed……. The Old Testament is about Jesus.
That is why I disagree strongly with Tunji, I think it is dangerous to start breaking the Old Testament up in to cute little stories about giants, big fish who swallow people, some brother betraying their brother, a king who committed adultrey……. In it we see human failure and in Christ we see the ultimate Israelite, Son, Temple, Law Keeper, Righteous one and King.
Lionel and all,
The Old Testament looked at in through the New Testament shows even more of our need of the Saviour.
It helps us to realize it was only through Christ that all the “stories” could be fulfilled.
Look at Genesis when God had to kill and animal to cover Adam and Eve.
Noah’s Ark a picture of Christ and baptism.
Abraham being chosen out of all the people and then when he was told sacrifice Issac. Yet another sacrifice was provided.
Circumcision of the flesh a picture of Christ
The passover and exodus from Egypt. The blood on the post. A picture of Christ blood.
We could go on and on.
To be honest it was when these things were pointed out to me that the Old Testament became exciting.
As Lionel stated that it is more than just some cute little stories for kids.
I praise God.
I feel once you have this understanding of the Old Testament then the New Testament becomes even more exciting to read. It becomes more alive.
We have to see the scriptures through an unclouded lense.
Now when I read some Old Testament stories to my kids I can point them to Christ in the story.
The whole bible is about JESUS!!!!!
That is awesome!!!!
Steven Owen
Lionel and Steven:
I know the OT is about Christ. That’s the beauty of it. But I need help in terms of distinguishing what I can and cannot claim (I hate to use that word due to misuse but it’s the only way I can explain what I mean) in my own life for application. Some stuff is very specific to those people at that time and I wouldn’t want to be ignorantly “claiming” those things for my own life. Am I making sense? Or better yet, did I miss your point completely???
Cool post. It’s been really cool this last couple of years for me, to start going back through the old testament, and seeing it through new eyes, ones that recognize Christ everywhere I turn!
I remember vividly maybe about a year ago, opening up the book of Proverbs, where it talks about Wisdom, and as I read, I realized that Wisdom was personified, refered to as a person. As I read on, it became clearer and clearer that this Wisdom was none other than Jesus! For like 9 chapters it goes on like that, speaking of Christ, refering to Him as Wisdom, which makes sense, because He is the living Word, the source of all wisdom itself… It still amazes me.
Javetta,
If we are talking of promises to claim (head and not the tail…..) we must be very careful. When we see promises given to Israel we have to immediately go into covenant mindset.
What I mean is this. Israel’s physical promises hinge upon one thing. That thing being the “Old Covenant”. We see that starting in Exodus and working its way through the rest of the Torah (5 books of Moses). For some reason many people ignore the “if” statments found in that covenant. “If” Israel is faithful to the “old” covenant then they will be able to walk in the promises Yahweh gave to them. However, if they are not faithful “ALL” of the curses that comes with disobeying the “old” covenant would come.
Reading your Old Testament were they faithful to the covenant or not? We both know the answer to that. That is why a “NEW” Covenant is promised in Jeremiah 31 in which the writer of Hebrews quotes extensively. This New Covenant would not be like the old. In where the old covenant would be outside of Israel (summarized in the Tablets of Stone or the 10 Commandemnts) the New Covenenant would be written on their hearts.
The first covenant was bilateral or better yet had obligations. The problem with it is that they could not live by it. They had no power so they failed miserably and we see them sent into captivity, the kingdom destroyed and so forth. The New Covenant however is a work of God alone in Christ. God not only sets forth the Covenant but it has an entirely new power. The power to obey (Through the work of the Spirit) is not something we conjure but something that is given.
I say that to say this. The promises under the Old Covenant are obsolete because the covenant is obsolete (Hebrews 8-9 and 2 Cor 3). Thus we have the fullness of the promise which is Christ. He is our Sabbath Rest, He is our Sabbath Day (perpetually) and He is our inheritance. As Abraham we don’t look for a “physical land” but we look for a city built by the hands of God as the writer of Hebrews says in Hebrews 11.
So we claim Christ and whatever He promised us, which I believe to be Himself. The promises under the old our dead.
Javetta,
I hear you clearly. I am just going through this same struggle myself. For one the tithe and how people use Old Testament scripture to back up something not in the New Testament. Also how some pastors use the Levites to describe themselves. (That is what I am going through right now.)
To be honest I feel Lionel may be able to handle your question more in depth. Because as I just stated I am still hashing out a lot of this myself.
Steven Owen
Javetta,
Are you also asking in terms of using OT scripture to stand by during times of intercession and prayer?
As an example “if My people who are called by my name would humble themselves and pray…”
Or some others that are used during times of ministry such as “Call unto Me and I will show you unsearchable things.”
Lionel, where do you see those things?
Again I feel I know the answer. I just want some more clarification.
As of this weekend the Lord has been putting this same stuff on my heart.
Sorting through what I have been taught and what is really for us.
Lionel,
A very necessary post. I am with you all the way .
I remember the face of a young man who had been attending this particular church all of his life (he was 21). We were doing a series entitled “Jesus Christ in Genesis”. His eyes opened wide, then his mouth. He said to me afterwards, “For the first time in my life, I’m beginning to understand”.
Thirty years on, he is still a true example of our God’s great grace as he has had to struggle with cancer in himself, and more lately in his wife who has endured a double mastectomy. He knows the Christ of the OT who is revealed in the NT as fulfilling what the saints of old understood Him to promise.
SO,
I think that verse in particular is referring to national Israel and the promise to heal their broken land if they would humble and turn away from their wickedness of persistent idolatry. There is no longer a theocracy, the true Israel is the Church in which Peter calls the “dispersion”. There is no land to heal because God now dwells within His people not some specific geographical location.
I think many times we can see the glory of God and as Paul says in 2 Corinthians 3 “these things were written as an example to us who believe”. We don’t take Paul’s words seriously I believe.
Aussie J,
How are you Sir? I think Genesis becomes even the more beautiful as we look at it through the lens of Christ and His redemptive work in unison with the Father and Spirit. From the slain lamb, to true worship (versus false worship we find in Cain) to Ark to Abraham to the ram provided for Isaac we see the beauty of Jesus throughout. Sir, why do you think this is not taught more often? Wathmen Nee does a beautiful job in some of his works.
Thanks, Lionel.
As stated this is something the Lord is pulling me through also. Just as you and Daniel posted about the modern nation Israel. He is purging me of the old mindset in that also.
Steven O.
Lionel-
Ok…so…what I’m saying is: I like to memorize scripture to renew my mind, to help be get a better idea about a characteristic of God, etc. I’m not trying to “claim” any promises of Israel for my own life or anything like that. I
And what you’re saying is: None of it applies to me anyway (except for those things that refer to the promise of Christ), so don’t even worry about the rest.
Is that correct? Or am I wring again? (Please don’t think I’m antagonizing you. I am really confused [you should see my face :-/] as I am new to all of this.)
Hey Javetta,
Oh no most of it applies to you, just how. For example when a blessing and curse is spoken by God what am I to do. The strawmen (if I wanted to build a strawman) would be Malachi 3:10 and 2 Chronicles 7:14. Other things like what do I take as normative is another filter one must uphold. As we read through the law of Moses (as I stated earlier) we must look at it through a Covenantal lens especailly when it gets into promises/curses.
Next we see plenty of examples in scripture. We see the devestation of Adultrey though we must be careful because an entire kingdom doesn’t rest on us. We see that complaining about our circumstances grieves God though we may not be made to wander in the desert for 40 years, we see that plurality is not accepted by God by reading the accounts of Solomon and the Kings that followed. We see that even at its best the human heart is wicked and deceptive apart from the “new heart” given under the new covenant (Jeremiah 17:9). We see that is impossible to please God apart from faith.
We see the depravity of humanity immediately after the fall with Cain and Able, we see that we don’t need to assist God and when it does it can have perpetual consequences (Abraham and Hagar). We see that a little compromise can jeopradize our entire family (with Lot and his family), we see that our parenting effects our children (just look at Jacob and how his children behaved), we see that God is sovereign over life, the elements and the universe and will not be out glorified in the Exodus account. We see that God uses “the weak things to shame the strong or the foolish things to shame the wise” in the selection of David as king. In the same account we see that our human effort of judging the outside of men and thus praising him is not what God judges who judges the heart (the people loved Saul because of his beauty and stature). When we look at the narratives there are many ethical things we can draw from, but we must be careful in trying to pack them in to cute little sermons that play on words and rob them of their significance of their place and structure in redemptive history.
Thats all I am trying to say. No need to worry about antagonizing. Keep the questions coming. It is hard to convey it all in one post.
Javetta,
This is called Iron sharpening Iron. We are all still learning and what better way than to bother Lionel, since he is going to school for this. He pays for it and we benefit.
LOL!!!
Seriously though that is what I like about blogging is we can all learn from each other.
Steven Owen
I don’t go to school, blogging and book plugs, and discussions with brothers and sisters like you have been a huge blessing. Plus being able to see all of this flushed out. So all of my schooling has been for 29.99 a month plus books and I don’t have to write papers you guys are grading my work!
Hey, that is even better. For some reason I thought you were going to seminary.
Sounds like you are doing it the way I am.
Unless I can got to SEBTS or Fuller or Wheaton or even better Providence Theological Seminary I ain’t going.
Lionel and Steven-
Thank you for being so patient with ya girl
L-
). I need schoolin’ brother! LOL
I know it’s a lot…and THAT”S why I’ve been trying to get together (and of course for some good ole fellowship
Steven-
. I think more than anything, I’m scared to let go of everything I’ve been taught because it’s my only understanding of my faith, but it’s smothering the life out of me. Thanks for chopping it up with me…
I am wrestling with so many things right now I don’t know whether I’m coming or going. I appreciate the fact that I’m not alone in the struggle
I hear you all the way to the bank…..
Javetta,
just remember it is all about the glory of Christ.
If it doesn’t bring glory to Christ then we need to let it go.
I just know that Jesus is the all in all. And He will lead us down through this stuff we are going through. Whether on our own or through people like Lionel and others.
Praise God.
Steven O
Lionel,
You ask, “why do you think this is not taught more often?”
Because new believers are not taught how to study the Scriptures, and think, for themselves, but are told what they must believe .
The result is that they attend churches, seminaries colleges, etc., which only teach what they have been told they must believe. In turn, the products of this system, don’t think for themselves for fear of the repercussions, and unthinkingly perpetuate distortions of truth.
It grieves me to hear, and read, people simply regurgitating what they have been told is true, rather than what they have found to be true from the Scriptures.
The New Testament is in the Old Testament concealed and the Old Testament is in the New Testament reviled. It is like apples of gold in a bowl of silver. It is exciting when you know and can see how every particular word is there for a reason and you can see Jesus the Messiah.
Brother Lionel
At one level, there is a sharp,radical discontinuity between the OT and the NT.In this sense Jesus Christ is the fulfillment of the OT prophecies,and,with the birth,death and resurrection of our Saviour the usefulness of the OT is at an end.It indeed is possible to use passages in Hebrews referring to a new and better covenant to justify this stance.
On the other hand there indeed is a radical continuity between the 2 covenants.Thus,the NT is the fulfillment of the OT prophecies,especially those that have to do with Jesus Christ. viewed in a broad hermeneutic sweep the OT,like John the Baptist was for Jesus,was a forerunner of the NT.
But,in addition to foretelling the coming covenant,the OT also spoke powerfully to the people of the time,and to us today.How are we to place prophecies about the oncoming destruction of kingdoms,and which have now come to pass?What of the many moral lessons?In their flaws and fallings and failings,they remind us that we are only human and that we depend on God to do His will,then and today.They serve as examples to us today,and I am not sure in their intimate detail they directly point to Jesus’ coming.
Yes,I am aware aware of books that have been written ‘discovering’ great theological lessons in the Song of Songs.But is it possible that book is simply talking about passion and love,things not unknown to Christians.
Finally,if we come to the Bible with a viewpoint that expects to see Jesus in all details of both testaments,that is exactly what we will see.
Tunji,
I never said that in “every intimate detail” we will find Christ. I am saying the theme of the Old Testament is Christ. And many of the narratives point to Christ while many things (especially the big ones) and events point to Christ. The bronze serpent, the red sea, the passover, the ram provided for Abraham, the covering of Adam and Eve after they fell, the promised land, the Sabbath rest, the entire Law, the festivals, the feasts, many of the biblical charachters were types of Christs, Moses, Joshua, Abraham, David. So we must look at their stories, writings and accomplishments in the light of Christ.
Next you say there is a radical “continuity” between the Covenants. How do you deal with scriptures that call the Old Covenant “a covenant of death”, “obsolete” “old” (doesn’t old mean that there is something new), “passing a way” “letters carved on stones of death”. If you belive there is radical continuity then men like Paul were clueless and definitely the writer of Hebrews, He shows a strict discontinuity between the Old and New throughout the entire book of Hebrews.
Finally I don’t disagree that you can get good moral stories; however, if you stop there you miss what the Old Testament is about. Or will you argue with Jesus’ words found in Luke 24?
My brother Lionel
1 Viewed from one perspective there indeed is a radical discontinuity between the OT and the NT,as the passages in Hebrews you refer to eloquently state.
On the other hand,however ,and viewed from another perspective there indeed is a radical continuity between the 2 Covenants.Please refer for example to Matthew 5:17-19-
‘Do not think tht I have come to abolish the Law or the prophets:I have come not to abolish them but to fulfill them.I tell you the truth,until heaven and earth disappear,not the smallest letter,not the least stroke of a pen,will by any any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished.Anyone who breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called the least in the kingdom of heaven,but whoever practices and teaches these commandments will be called great in the kingdom of heaven’.
It is like the old tale of the different parts of an elephant being ouched.Viewed from differing perspectives,different conclusions may be reached,but this does not by any means alter the reality of what is being examined.
2 I agree with you that in its central theme the OT points to Jesus.However,we should not ignore the many sub themes contained in its message,of relevance to those it was immediately addressed to,and to us today.
3 I am not quite sure the portion of Luke 24 you refer to,sir.
Let me ask you, did Christ accomplish what he came to do? What was it that He whispered on the cross?
Lionel,
I appreciate your efforts and for bearing your heart before us for our benefit and encouragement.
I have been greatly encouraged by Stephen Dempster’s book “Dominion and Dynasty: A Theology of the Hebrew Scriptures”. He does an excellent job of bringing out the unity in the OT Scriptures and the thrilling aspect is that it all points to the work of Jesus as the risen Lord and the Church as the promised dominion and dynasty.
Thanks again for the post!
- Steve Ward
Man.. I love the Old Testament.
God revealed to me the pwoer fo the Old Testament because I learned about types and shadows.
And I cannot get enough of it, even the judgement sections and rebukes from God speak to me in some ways.
1. Gods Spirit will reveal truth, pray that you would receive from the Old. Don’t rule it out as out of date or irrelevant.
2. God did not put those histories and stories in there for nothing, realize the deeper truth of them and how they set up things for the NT and for Jesus to come.
3. You don’t watch a movie from the middle to the end, you can enjoy it and talk about it but watching the beginning will help you understand and enjoy the end much better.
Javetta,
Pick up a copy of Peter Leithart’s A House for My Name published by Canon Press. It is an excellent survey of the main themes of the OT.
The OT is boring!? No wonder you creationist never know what it contains, you fell asleep during that part.
It’s full of god telling his people to murder and rape, slay this slay that. In fact come to think of it, you may want to denounce your religion.